Barbara shares a valuable lesson in speaking out about menopause. After a lonely, decade-long struggle with symptoms, an inadvertent joke with her doctor changed everything. “I wish I had mentioned it sooner. I wish I had talked about it sooner. I wish I had in my annual check-ups...Why didn't I?”
In this episode we hear from Barbara, who has dealt with symptoms shared by many women, namely hot flushes, night sweats, and heart health issues, that occur all too frequently as we get older. She found a lack of opportunities to talk about menopause and build a support network meant she had to deal with another common issue: isolation.
Barbara managed her symptoms on her own for over 10 years before seeking help, So many women could have less isolating menopause experiences if they spoke openly about their symptoms and the impact on their lives. I hope Barbara inspires you to speak up and find a friendly listening ear.
Episode 3, Barbara’s Story
Mary Jane Minkin
It's time to unmute menopause.
Hello and welcome to menopause: unmuted, a podcast series sponsored by Pfizer.
Menopause is a major transition in life, with many changes and a lot to learn. And that’s not just for the women experiencing it, but also, for the partners, family and friends who join us on our journey through life.
But that road doesn’t need to be a lonely one; we’re here to help make that easier by listening to how other woman have navigated their menopause journeys.
Susan Teaser clip
For me, my experience with menopause really is predominantly the fact of the hot flashes and the sweats all the time. That really is my biggest symptom continues to be, but way less frequently. It's to the point that you can't shake somebody's hand because your hands are wet to the point that clothing gets soaked through. And you never know what's even going to bring it on. Sometimes it's a sip of wine and you're done for the night.
Marilyn Teaser clip
So, I feel that I'm in the best stage of my life right now. I feel accomplished in terms of right, like it wouldn't, if you look at yourself, I guess if you do like an inventory of what are you doing with your life, where are you right now? I feel like I have accomplished a lot, you know, and, but I haven't stopped.
MJM
I’m your host, Mary Jane Minkin. I’m an obstetrician gynecologist and Clinical Professor at Yale University School of Medicine.
As you probably know by now, we love to celebrate the power of good communication and good information.
Today I’d like to introduce you to Barbara
Barbara preview clip
I didn't really know that that was a hot flash or menopause. I didn't really know what it was. In my family growing up, it was never mentioned. My mother never mentioned menopause to me. And in fact, it was a topic that she would never even mention to me. I guess that was that generation.
MJM
Barbara’s had to deal with symptoms shared by many women, namely hot flashes, and night sweats. And the lack of opportunities to talk about menopause and build a support network meant she had to deal with another common issue: isolation. Here’s Barbara:
Barbara
My name is Barbara, and I am 65 years old. I am the proud mother of four grown children and the even prouder grandmother of six grandchildren.
I am lucky enough to live in Toronto but spend a lot of time in the United States where four of my grandchildren are. And I call myself a professional grandmother at this stage in life, and I am very blessed to be able to do that.
I am a fitness addict. In my younger years, I worked out twice a day three times a day. I previously was very involved in community work, which got me out of the house in a meaningful way. And as I said, now I am looking after grandchildren on two different continents and loving really every minute of my, of my active life at the ripe old age of 65.
MJM
For many women, peri-menopausal symptoms can be a gradual creep. The average age for these symptoms to begin is around 46, but symptoms can begin much earlier as full menopause occurs for at least 5% of women by age 45.
Signs can begin to show earlier than you might expect, because peri menopause should be on your radar from your early 40s – it’s nothing to worry about, just listen to your body for signs of change. But for Barbara, it was early, and it was sudden...
Barbara
My menopause started when I was, was too young to even really know what menopause was or to think much about it. I was about 40 if I can recall correctly 40/41 maybe. And it started with a walk down a street. I was wearing a white blouse and, and jeans, and out of nowhere from the bottoms of my toes to the top of my head, this electric shock went through my body and the sweat started pouring off me, I felt dizzy, I felt nauseous, I felt weak. My white blouse was now see through because I had sweat so much… I had to tuck myself into a nearby coffee shop to sit down and figure out what was going on, and everybody's asking me, are you alright? Are you all right? And you know, so five minutes later, I'm alright. And now I'm dripping in sweat and freezing cold.
And I didn't really know that that was a hot flash or menopause. I didn't really know what it was. In my family growing up, it was never mentioned. My mother never mentioned menopause to me. And in fact, it was a topic that she would never even mention to me. I guess that was that generation.
MJM
As you can hear, this is a recurrent theme in our relationship centred season.
Barbara
So I carried on my merry way, and I was married at the time, and the one thing my husband, he did not want to hear about menopause. He did not want me to talk about it. He didn't want to hear the word. And so I really… because I was so young, and I really had nobody to talk to about this. I couldn't mention it to him. I couldn't mention it. I didn't mention it to my friends because I didn't assume that they would be of any help to me. And these hot flashes and now the night sweats are starting and I've, I've put two and two together at this point. And really those were the only two symptoms that I experienced during menopause except for gas, which, you know, it is what it is.
And so but those are really the only two symptoms that I experienced, perhaps because I was, I was fit, and I was in good shape. I didn't have the fatigue. I didn't have the mood swings. I didn't have the dry vagina, I don't know why I didn't but I, I really did have life altering night sweats and hot flashes.
MJM
One of the great things about menopause coming out into the open is that more women are learning to spot more of the signs.
Unfortunately, Barbara had to deal with this by herself: no previous information for her from her mom, no friends dealing with it – or they were dealing with it in silence – and no support from her husband.
And for American women, hot flashes are the most common symptoms. Moderate hot flashes are described as those that make you break into a sweat, but you can still keep functioning through them. Severe hot flashes are described in that you break into a sweat, but you have to stop dead in your tracks. You cannot function.
Hot flashes and night sweats are sort of the same mechanism. Basically, at night, they wake you up. And some women actually seem to wake up first, and then get the flash, some get the flash, which seems to awaken them.
And it’s about more than feeling too hot. Many women tell me that they have to alter their lifestyles to accommodate their hot flashes. And if you don’t want – for whatever reason – to discuss this with your nearest and dearest, it can be a lonely path to walk, especially if you feel you are ‘too young’ to be going through this.
Here’s Barbara again…
Barbara
I felt very lonely. I felt very… just very lonely and isolated because I didn't feel that I had anybody to talk to about it. And as I said, my husband, he did not want to hear the word menopause, he did not want to talk about it. And that's probably, you know, an indication of the generation of his family too.
So as a married couple, menopause was the elephant in the bed because we didn't talk about it. And I was having such severe night sweats and during the night and hot flashes during the day, so we coped with it as best we could within the confines of not being able to talk about it or deal with it, and we just sort of ignored it. So did menopause impact by my married life? Perhaps, but I do want to make it clear that menopause had nothing to do with my divorce, that we, we coped with it in the best way we could. And [and] there were other factors that that contributed to the end of the marriage.
MJM
But even if you can’t talk to those closest to you, the experience of other women can be incredibly valuable.
Barbara
I was not going to let hot flashes affect my life. I just wasn't. And I just proceeded in my life as if they weren't there. In my community work, I happened to be working with an older woman who had a hand fan. And she's fanning herself and what she said was, you know, this is menopause, and you have to learn to make friends with your symptoms. And I sort of embraced that, that philosophy was that you know, what's the al… this is better than the alternative having menopause. So it's a fact of life. It's a passage in life, it's a phase in life and make friends with the symptoms as best you can and deal with it. There are far, far more difficult things to deal with within life. I'm, I'm a very, I try and keep my life very, very stress free. And I've always believed that there is no point in worrying about things that you can't change, and you have no control over. And at that point, I was not speaking to a doctor about this and so I was not using medication to control it. And so I just, you know, wasn't gonna worry about it. I didn't think there was a way to change it.
For 10 years, I had hot flashes and night sweats and, and dealt with it. It was a fact of life. It was part of my life. And I didn't think twice about it.
And yeah, of course, I wish I had mentioned it sooner. I wish I had talked about it sooner. I wish I had in my annual check-ups, I wish I had mentioned it sooner. Why didn’t I? I have no, I can’t answer that question. I don’t know why I didn’t. And it was only in passing. It was only about joking about my advantages to being divorced and being able to roll over to the other side of the bed that changed my life. I, you know, I'm [I'm I'm] a smart woman. I'm a highly educated woman, but I[‘m] pretty idiotic, I guess when it came to menopause.
MJM
Barbara’s story really shows me how important a trusting and open relationship with your health care provider is.
Her casually mentioning her disruptive night sweats meant her doctor could get involved and help.
Talking to your health care provider about your menopause symptoms, no matter how insignificant they might feel to you, or how you might perceive others feel they are not significant: they are. Or how accustomed to them you might have become - that’s important.
You don’t have to ‘put up and shut up’ and there are a host of different treatment options, from lifestyle changes, to talk therapy and exercise.
So many women could have a more manageable menopause experience if they spoke honestly to their health care providers as soon as the symptoms start to show up.
And remember, there’s no ‘one size fits all’ approach, and if something hasn’t worked for you in past it doesn’t mean there isn’t something else that might help you.
This is menopause: unmuted where we talk about real women’s menopause stories.
I’m your host Mary Jane Minkin and if you’d like to find out about participating in a future episode, visit menopauseunmuted.com
That’s also where you can get more information about menopause, or you can talk to your health care provider.
As Barbara said earlier, fitness played a very big part in her life, and lots of women find that exercise really helps them manage their symptoms.
But fitness plays a very important role in another aspect of menopause, that in my experience, is less frequently talked about: heart health.
What are the risk factors? There certainly are well known risk factors of cardiovascular disease. Of course, a family history is quite relevant – and you can’t do anything about that – but there are many things you can do to help yourself. Exercise regularly, eat a healthy diet with a lot of plant-based foods, and don’t smoke.
One statement I often make to women about heart disease…think of the folks you know who’ve had heart attacks. Do you know some men who’ve had a heart attack before 50? And the answer is almost always yes. And then I ask, how about women? And the answer is usually no, I don’t. But after 50? We all know men and women who’ve had heart attacks in that range.
These issues turned out to be crucially important to Barbara, let’s get back to her story.
Barbara
So, here I am, my life is great and I’m single and I’m doing all sorts of things that I, that I never thought that I would be doing. And I was hiking and kayaking in [in] Norway and I was stopped in my tracks by a pain in my, my throat as it happens, and sweating and just weakness. And I thought nothing about it. I just thought well okay, I’m working hard. Long story short, I ended up having what’s called a widow maker, which is a 90 plus percent blockage of your [your] main cardiac artery.
So but most people would have died on that hiking trip in in Norway with the kind of blockage I had.
MJM
By the way, Barbara’s description of a severe pain in her throat, with the sweating and weakness, those are actually fairly common symptoms in women and totally uncommon symptoms in men – which tends to define the syndrome of heart attack. And Barbara as she commented, thought nothing about it, and that’s indeed why women often times end up with the worst outcome from their cardiac disease, because they just aren’t experiencing the classic male chest pain scenario.
Again, Barbara’s fitness was crucially important here and I’m very glad to say she made a great recovery.
There’s more information about cardiovascular health in our bonus episode on exercise and heart health – do check it out. Here’s Barbara again.
Barbara
And guess what? we are back to the hot flashes and the night sweats. So how am I dealing with that? Well, I'm rolling over in bed to the other side. And I'm doing daily arm toning workouts because I'm only wearing sleeveless, and I am making friends with my symptoms. Not that they really want to be friends with me, but I am, I'm trying.
MJM
So that’s Barbara’s situation now – she’s still having hot flashes many years after her menopause. People ask how normal is that? Unfortunately, Barbara is not alone, about 10% of women will continue to have significant hot flashes for more than 10 years post menopausally. But the good news is even in that time frame they do tend to get better over the course of time.
Most of Barbara’s peers have moved through that phase already and are now post-menopausal and that can be tough when you’re still dealing with the symptoms.
Barbara
So when I started the menopause journey, I was alone. I didn't talk to anybody. I didn't research it. I dealt with it all alone. And here we are. 25 years later, and I feel still alone in the in the menopause journey. All my friends have all been through it and they're, they're finished with it. I now have many friends who are years older than I am and they certainly don’t want to talk about [talk about] menopause. And at this point in, in, in, in the journey, I don't want to talk about it either. There's not a whole lot to say, there's no need to talk about it today. And I'm just gonna deal with it. And, you know, as best I can, and keep my fingers crossed that one day, all the symptoms will stop.
I only wish I had a crystal ball and could look at it and it would tell me when these would end but there isn't such a thing. And I just go on each day enjoying my [my, my] active lifestyle, and my grandchildren and my children. And at the end of the day, I'm pretty lucky.
Barbara
The one suggestion that I would make to everybody is… to mothers, if you’re mothers of daughters that I would, [I would] recommend highly that you talk about it with your girls. You talk about it with your husbands if they'll you know if they'll let you. And I think that is the, the biggest regret that I had, that I didn’t talk to my own mother about it. I didn’t talk to friends about it. I didn’t talk to my doctor about it. That’s the one regret I had. Would the outcome, would it be any different? Probably not. But it would have given me a greater understanding and a greater security and comfort, knowing that this is all normal. And that this is, you know, it's manageable and you deal with it in whatever way you choose to deal with it.
If I had had the chance to, to, today to ask my mother about this, I would come right out and say, Mom, how old were you when you went through menopause? And what were your symptoms? And how did you deal with it? I would be very frank; I would be very forthwith about it. And I would just ask her; when, how, why, what, you know, the all the W questions.
If I had one piece of advice for mothers out there of, of adult daughters, it would be to talk to them. Don't wait for them to talk to you and ask you about your menopause. Talk to them and tell them your experience. And perhaps their experience will be different than yours. But [but] moms, let your daughters know. This is what's gonna happen next, you know, you've gone through menstruation, and you've gone now you're childbearing, and one day you're gonna go through menopause. It's a different phase. It's, it's a different, it's a different part of your life. But moms let your daughters know that there is this thing called menopause. And they are going to experience it one way or another. And they should be aware of it and prepared for it as I wasn't, and which is what made me feel very alone in my journey. Your daughters don't need to go through that.
It's all a matter of how you approach it. And I happen to approach it in a way that I did because I had no choice really. And I'm not a complainer, so I complain about nothing. And I think the best the best thing I heard was, you know, make friends with your symptoms, because they're not going away for a long time and they're not the enemy. The, you know, the [the] alternative is worse than then having menopause. So….
MJM
Some of the children whom I have delivered are indeed beginning to deal with perimenopausal symptomatology, and I am delighted to be here to help them deal with these issues. I encourage all of my patients who have daughters entering the perimenopause to talk with their daughters about it. And I always ask them to have them send me their questions so I can help answer.
I think Barbara’s story really encapsulates the power of communication, staying active and being able to laugh at situations which would otherwise make you despair. I’d like to say a huge thank you Barbara for sharing her experience.
Menopause is different for everyone and there is no right or wrong way through it. Some women, like Barbara, are hit hard by hot flashes, for others the challenges are emotional and for some, it’s both, but if you can make friends with your menopause, it will make the journey more comfortable.
I’m Mary Jane Minkin, thanks for joining us today. Check out our show notes at menopauseunmuted.com.
And if you have a menopause story that you’d like to share, that’s also where you can find information on taking part in our next season.
Join me for our next episode when we’ll be listening to Susan.
Susan Preview clip
I wasn’t always upset and always snappy, but the truth is, is that when you’re walking around and you’re very uncomfortable physically all the time, I had a pretty significant, to me case of menopause, and it happened frequently throughout the day. And you know, I’d be at work, and I’d be sweating, and it was uncomfortable seeing people, you do get upset. And that was something that I really felt I had to deal with.
MJM
However you want to navigate it, don’t suffer in silence. Don’t worry about speaking up about your menopause.
Women should be able to discuss menopause with their health care providers. A woman can speak out about menopause with her OB/GYN, primary care provider, nurse practitioner or midwife. There are even designated menopause practitioners that a woman can visit if she needs more information.
Special thanks to the Women's Health team at Pfizer and to Studio Health for producing this series.
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Disclaimer [read by Brad]
Ident: This podcast is powered by Pfizer.